HBO made Catelyn Stark say “and i knew i was the worst woman who ever lived” for not loving Jon Snow
HBO made Sansa Stark kneel.
uh oh it’s down time at work, so i have some meta on hbo’s misogynistic tendencies. :) :) :) (hopefully i can curtail my usual wordiness, but don’t hold your breath)
first of all, let’s get rid of that “it’s historically accurate!!” fallacy. though not for the usual…
Game of Thrones: “I watch this for the plo—”
Oh hell no, I watch it for the attractive as fuck people. The plot is so fucked right now; I don’t even know how any of this shit could possibly come together.
So I’ve been thinking a lot about what bothers me specifically about Talisa - not just the entire storyline, which I’ve ranted about extensively, but Talisa specifically.
(Not very long but cut for no1curr)
1. Stannis/Jorah -> In order to help Dany cross the narrow sea, Davos must seduce the other guy claiming that the throne is his by rights.
Dany/Doran Martell - She has to reward him somehow for the loss of his son.
All if forgiven if they give me Catelyn/Tywin. THAT IS YOUR ONLY HOPE, HBO. GIVE ME THE CATWIN.
Found this for @onionjulius while browsing magazines at the drugstore. It was in the “official” GoT mag.
THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU
THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOUTHANKYOUTHANKY T Y T Y TYTYT YTYTY TYTYTYTYYTYTYTYTYTY
*casually hits the reblog button*
These are actual things I want to know.
I actually want to make this happen so.
What do I do who do I talk to where do I send the complaints etc?
I’m seriously serious I want to do something about this who can I talk to that has some kind of clout. I want to get something GOING.
So do I!!!! Anything I can do to help it along just let me know!!!!
all i want for christmas is for catelyn stark, petyr baelish, and robb stark to be in character in season 3 of game of thrones. i have faith in the other characters and the new ones, but please, for the love of the drowned god, give me IC catelyn, petyr, and robb, PLEASE.
(made rebloggable by request)
- Cat is unhappy that 10 year old Bran is going to see an execution. In the books she thinks 3 year old Rickon is too young to be expected not to be scared of a direwolf, but that’s not exactly the same, not only because of the age difference but because actual direwolves are not part of Ned’s models of northern/Starky lordliness, while performing one’s own executions are. Book!Cat accepts that her children will be northern and Starky all the way, especially her boys (but not necessarily herself because it isn’t really necessary, just the heirs matter, etc).
- Cat is nervous at the idea of Sansa marrying the prince, and livid at the idea of Ned accepting Robert’s offer to become king. In the book, she is very open to the ambitious potential of these offers, however, and Lysa’s letter saying that the Lannisters killed Jon Arryn only strengthened her resolve, since Ned could use the power to pursue justice. She didn’t want to be separated from Ned, but she did suck it up with pretty much minimal fuss, because that’s what Catelyn does with her personal desires — suck them up. They don’t matter. That’s how she lives. In the book, therefore, she is very much a product of her society, a great (as in high on the aristocratic ladder) noble lady with dynastic interests and an unquestioned sense of self sacrifice as a product of internalized patriarchic norms. In the show, she’s the hero’s Little Woman, symbolizing hearth and home and everything the hero must leave behind, helping to define his conflict and angst, and devoid of the kinds of ambitions that would offend people in a female character, even confuse them (hah hah hah) in a non Femme Fatale.
- At Bran’s bedside Catelyn begs Ned not to go, bitterly accusing him of caring too much about honor and duty like all men. In the book, I don’t think Catelyn would EVER be bitter about honor and duty. In fact, it’s Petyr Baelish who is bitter at how much she embraces those principles. Family Duty Honor — it’s like they decided Family = female and Duty Honor = male, and I really hate that. That’s not Cat, that’s not the point of her construction. She is not the little woman who just wants to nest up all cozy and isolated from the outside problems. If anything that’s Ned, he’s the Little
WoMan, he just happens to be living his brother’s life thanks to circumstance.
- They omitted “It should have been you” when Jon came in to see Bran. They also omitted a lot about the background of this tension so maybe it equalizes out, but it is a change and it’s fair to say that they thought it’d help people like her better.
- They had Cat suspect the Lannisters’ role in Bran’s fall because she found a golden hair, instead of remembering that Jaime had not joined the other men in the hunt that day. It’s not a huge deal but it is stupid XD
- When she enters King’s Landing she just waltzes right in on her horse. In the book they showed what efforts she and Rodrik went through to avoid being seen by people who’d know her there. Again it’s maybe not as huge a deal but it does make her seem less smart, and a lesser deal that Varys was able to find her.
- In the show she throws something at Littlefinger and calls him a little worm. Book!Catelyn would never be so demonstrative, she expresses her disdain coldly and aloofly in situations like this. She withholds her familiarity and that’s what wounds Petyr; she doesn’t throw things like a little kid.
- In the show she also objects to being in a brothel because, it’s implied, it’s improper and sinful and unladylike or whatever. In the books, she is shown to be far less prudish and sensitive in her sexual sensibilities than men assume her to be/project on her. What she objected to in the book was being ordered around despite being a great lady, not that she was in a place of sin or whatever. It’s understandable that they had to abbreviate the bedroom scene in Winterfell, but the sum total is that that aspect of characterization, a testament to the little ways that men’s concepts of women are not really real, is just gone.
- In the mountains of the moon, HBO!Cat cowers against a rock while the men fight the attacking clansmen. In the book, when she’s attacked Tyrion saves her, and then when he’s in danger she cuts the attacker’s throat with her dagger. It’s not something she usually does, and I wouldn’t expect her to come off like a badass ninja warrior, but she still did it because it had to be done to protect her prisoner, and we lose that really interesting dynamic between Cat and Tyrion, can I trust him maybe I can maybe I can’t etc.
- In the Eyrie all her observations about the ridiculousness of Lysa’s overly officious proceedings, her sham trial, are gone. She’s disappointed when Tyrion is freed, but there’s no reason a viewer wouldn’t conclude that she’s just unhappy that her side lost. There’s nothing there about the mockery of justice or the ramifications of losing Tyrion as a hostage. She’s mad that Lysa won’t help her husband confront the Lannisters; this comes off to me like an obvious band-aid to correct her non-confrontational demeanor when she first got Lysa’s letter. It’s internally inconsistent of course because they fucked up at the beginning.
- When Catelyn and Robb reunite in episode 1x08, we never see him going to her for advice/encouragement on his battle plans, not there nor after. We get instead this inserted scene showing how Robb uses a caught prisoner to his advantage to trick Tywin, and that’s all well and good since Robb did have his cunning in the books too, but obviously the balance is different. Compounding this, after the battle at Whispering Wood, Robb gives this speech that basically echoes Catelyn’s sentiments throughout the books, that one battle does not a won war make, etc. In season two, when he meets with Talisa he’s outraged at the thought of her thinking he’s fighting for glory. In the books it’s Catelyn who is the mouthpiece of caution and prudence and war, that it isn’t about glory and it shouldn’t be prematurely celebrated, etc. Gone too is the scene in A Clash of Kings where she chides Robb for using Grey Wind for melodramatics when sending his terms to Cersei. The whole balance is different and Catelyn’s particular role as the main adult, mature and wise voice in Team Stark is pretty much erased entirely.
- In the King in the North scene, Catelyn should have been standing against the whole hoard of men pleading wisely, maturely, rationally and bravely in the face of futility, for peace and life and no more killing. The show gave her a little worried glance, as if this is going to mean anything to show viewers. She was a star, if not THE star in that scene and the show obviously took the entirely opposite view.
- In the books it is Catelyn’s idea to treat with Renly, it is she who sees the political advantage there. In the show that idea is given to Robb. Robb has cunning on the battlefield but politics is his mother’s forte relative to his, in the books. Why change it, why.
- In the books Catelyn does NOT want to go home to Bran and Rickon, she insists on being by Robb’s side, believing in her own usefulness to him, believing that she can best help all her children by helping him (and she’s right). In the show, it’s as if they felt that if she didn’t express the desire to go home all the time, if she wanted to do anything other than return to her smallest children, she would be a Bad Mother, because mothers belong with babies not grown men, grown men can only be nagged and emasculated by mothers after all. They had to reassure the audience that she is a Good Mother by showing she knows her place — in the home, out of men’s manly affairs.
- In the books it is completely her idea to free Jaime, for better or for worse. In the show it’s implied that she was prey to Littlefinger’s manipulations. In the books, she takes total responsibility for her actions, because for good or ill, the point is SHE chose, it’s HER choice. The tv show seeks to mitigate her culpability by making her a poor victim of a mean mean man. While it was a good idea to remind viewers that Tyrion did say he’d give back her daughters, they could’ve handled the whole deal differently overall.
- In the books, it is after she learns that Bran and Rickon died that she frees Jaime. There are other things, yes, like the girls’ persisting danger, like Karstark’s deathwish for Jaime, but it took THAT to make it happen. In the show neither she nor Robb even knows about Bran and Rickon’s fates when they do their big mistakes (letting Jaime go, sleeping with Talisa/Jeyne). And then in the show Robb comes back and scolds his mommy for being stupid and irrational and zomg betraying him scarring him 4 lyfe, whereas in the book they were both caught in this situation where they had to forgive each other. It’s like B&W couldn’t WAIT to drive home what an EMOTIONAL and SILLY little woman Cat is compared to her righteous manly man son — who then goes on to process his anger by marrying Talisa? The emotional logic behind these changes are stupefying, I literally have no words.
- They really abbreviated the relationship between Cat and Brienne, by moving up Jaime’s release. I feel like Brienne has already spent more time with Jaime than with Cat, and S3 hasn’t even started yet. Understanding her loyalty to Lady Stark is not going to be as natural.
D.B. Weiss, Inside HBO’s Game of Thrones (via tumblrofthrones)
well. we all know how this turned out.
the idea of being “just” a wife and mother means they never got her from the beginning imo